Curse

Ole Man Bourbon · Nov 12, 2005, 03:51 AM // 03:51

I think you should really have at least 1 open PvP only toon slot. I'd drop a PvE character or get another copy of the game (what I did :P ).

master_ranger_matt · Nov 12, 2005, 03:55 AM // 03:55

i say faction should be sellable, because i would be rich right now if i hadn't had wasted 25k or so of faction on useless runes or upgrades or skills which i have unlocked in pve.

-Loki- · Nov 12, 2005, 04:48 AM // 04:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sofonisba

For people like the OP and myself, though, we both started out totally disinterested in PvP, and filled up our account with 4 PvE characters before getting the PvP bug.

You know that you can do the competition and team arenas, Tombs, and GvG with PvE characters, right?

Yeah, but faction was put there for use in PvP like gold, farming and skill points in PvE. It's the PvP method of getting items. If you allow Faction to be used for PvE stuff, gols and skill points have to be shifted to PvP as well, and Arenanet specifically made faction so that shouldn't happen.

PieXags · Nov 12, 2005, 05:25 AM // 05:25

The best thing to use faction on in my opinion would be if you could trade faction for money. If I could trade faction for money, I'd, you know, NOT have to spend countless hours doing shit I don't want to because I don't run a farming build. Maybe if people could spend faction for money people wouldn't BITCH so much about the new patch screwing up their 1337 skills.

imaginary friend · Nov 12, 2005, 05:29 AM // 05:29

faction is only pointless if your a narrow minded pve character. create a pvp character... have a good time- get all the upgrades you want for certain professions

EDIT: narrow minded account with 4 pve characters

PieXags · Nov 12, 2005, 05:33 AM // 05:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by imaginary friend

faction is only pointless if your a narrow minded pve character. create a pvp character... have a good time- get all the upgrades you want for certain professions

EDIT: narrow minded account with 4 pve characters

I think it's pointless, and I'm not at all what you described. I've just got nothing left of use to unlock.

Think before you flame next time, 'eh?

heist23 · Nov 12, 2005, 06:56 AM // 06:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkyX

Yes but unless you have the best runes and perfect weapons, chances are that a PvP character would own you.

my halfmoon is +12% while in a stance, +25 fortitude, and 1/1 zealous. i STILL own (most of the time) PvP players with my PvE ranger.

in short, that statement is false.

Quote:

Originally Posted by imaginary friend

faction is only pointless if your a narrow minded pve character. create a pvp character... have a good time- get all the upgrades you want for certain professions

EDIT: narrow minded account with 4 pve characters

uh-huh......................you don't say.

well, anyway.

as for faction...

ANET: let me trade in faction for GOOOOOLD!!!!!

but then that would lead to a major price inflation, so maybe not.

oh well.

crimsonfilms · Nov 12, 2005, 07:58 AM // 07:58

Gold is of no use for PvP char. So no - faction should not be sold for gold. There is no logic for it. Especially consider gold is not really that important. I am unsure why faction should be sellable.

Shen Xi · Nov 12, 2005, 11:53 AM // 11:53

Sure your charcter can probably play certain things almost as good but can you really be as daptive as a pure pvp charcter?

Just using the ranger as an example, do you ahev all the diff bows to run ranger spike, or intterupt ranger or a good staff for playing a trapper or.... you get the point.

might have the druid's armour for max energy, but say you're in a build which uses greater conflag and winter, do you just ahpen to have a spare set fo frostbound armour lying around?

do you have an approiate mask with all the diff sup ranger runes so you cna ahve your stats set optimally?

i could go on with mroe examples but i won't. in general pve charcters are fine for a set particular role but aren't anywhere near flexible enough for a lot fo things.

Navaros · Nov 12, 2005, 03:17 PM // 15:17

You should be able to trade/sell Faction for gold if you want to. It's your Faction, you should have a choice on how to use it. And you should also be able to use it for something after you have everything already unlocked.

If everything is unlocked, then Faction is indeed garbage.

Making it tradeable for gold would fix this problem.

Whosaidwhatnow · Nov 12, 2005, 05:14 PM // 17:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadowspawn X

Faction is for PvP'rs it was put there to stop their whining about having to play the game (which they reffer to as grind), and has had a very negative effect on PvE. They probelm is they give too much faction to PvP'rs for a Player Kill as opposed to XP for a PvE toon playing PvP.

If you have a PvP toon and a PvE toon on the same team in random. You get 20 faction per kill plus a 25 faction bonus for winning for a total of 105 faction per win. You also get 25 XP per player kill for a total of 100 XP per win.

After a 10 game winning streak they have 1050 faction and 1000 XP. The pvp toon is free to choose the skill of his choice at this point, because a skill unlock is a measly 1000 faction. On the other hand the 1000 XP does nothing for the PvE toon because a skill point is 15,000 XP so he is only 6.6% on his way to a skill point. As a matter of fact the PvE toon has to win 150 straight games for one skill point.

I say to heck with faction.
Anet needs to bring XP for Player Kills in line with faction.

So that people wont abanden their PvE toons when they start PvP.

You're neglecting to mention that a PvP char can't customize his weapon for that 20% (constant) damage, can't wear any nice looking armor, can't go anywhere but 3-4 different areas... that XP they get doesn't do them any good if they don't play a PvE char as well. PvP players don't have it easy at all. I say leave faction alone.

Edit: on second thought, the XP they get does them no good whatsoever, unless they want to show their numbers off to someone... skill points are useless if you can't get to a town and buy skills. All they get is faction... if you play a PvE char in PvP you get to reap both benefits, so the system favors PvE chars over PvP ones.

Loviatar · Nov 12, 2005, 05:36 PM // 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navaros

You should be able to trade/sell Faction for gold if you want to. It's your Faction, you should have a choice on how to use it. And you should also be able to use it for something after you have everything already unlocked.

If everything is unlocked, then Faction is indeed garbage.

Making it tradeable for gold would fix this problem.

NO

faction was put in very specifically as an ALTERNATIVE method to get skills,upgrades,top stat everything much faster than PVE and most specifically to avoid having to *GRIND IN PVE WHICH WE DONT WANT TO DO*

they gave you your avoid PVE at all costs method and you will not be able to use your PVP only faction for any PVE function including gold

when you have unlocked everything in PVP faction has done exactly what it was meant to do and now it is of no further use to you.

GO OUT AND ENJOY THE REWARDS OF UAS/UAU/UAEVERYTHING AND PVP YOUR BRAINS OUT FOR FUN

Navaros · Nov 13, 2005, 12:06 AM // 00:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

NO

faction was put in very specifically as an ALTERNATIVE method to get skills

Exactly. Faction was put in for a very specific purpose, before the idea was fully fleshed-out. This is evidenced by how they originally took XP away when putting Faction in, then (rightfully) put XP back in a few weeks later. They took XP out originally, because they implemented the concept of Faction without first thinking the idea all the way through.

It is by the same token that they forgot to give a useful purpose to Faction for people who have everything unlocked. They put the idea of Faction in as "quickfix" before it occurred to them that a final use for it in the endgame does not exist.

Now that Faction has been in place for a while and plenty of time has passed for the devs to have seen the improvements that can and should be made to Faction idea, there is no reason for them not to implement those improvements.

FireFox · Nov 13, 2005, 12:26 AM // 00:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shen Xi

Sure your charcter can probably play certain things almost as good but can you really be as daptive as a pure pvp charcter?

Just using the ranger as an example, do you ahev all the diff bows to run ranger spike, or intterupt ranger or a good staff for playing a trapper or.... you get the point.

might have the druid's armour for max energy, but say you're in a build which uses greater conflag and winter, do you just ahpen to have a spare set fo frostbound armour lying around?

do you have an approiate mask with all the diff sup ranger runes so you cna ahve your stats set optimally?

i could go on with mroe examples but i won't. in general pve charcters are fine for a set particular role but aren't anywhere near flexible enough for a lot fo things.

Actualy, pve characters are better for these reasons, weapons from pve can be more specialised (Yakslapper). and if you do have all the armors / runes theres no need to remake every time.

BurningPants · Nov 13, 2005, 12:28 AM // 00:28

The best idea that has been suggested so far was that faction should unlock non-combat related bonuses, like emotes, or items(like the halloween items) or hairstyles or all those other things you want to customize on your PvE character. Gives a PvE player more incentive to PvP and maybe develop an interest for it.

Loviatar · Nov 13, 2005, 12:57 AM // 00:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navaros

Now that Faction has been in place for a while and plenty of time has passed for the devs to have seen the improvements that can and should be made to Faction idea, there is no reason for them not to implement those improvements.

faction has and is serving the pvp role it was intended for.

the pvp players expressed themselves loudly and emphatically that they wanted nothing to do with pve and demanded a non pve method of unlocking everything.

they got it and i do not see Anet letting pvp faction go for something the pvp players didnt want

special non pvp items get them the pve way.

Shen Xi · Nov 13, 2005, 02:14 AM // 02:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by FireFox

Actualy, pve characters are better for these reasons, weapons from pve can be more specialised (Yakslapper). and if you do have all the armors / runes theres no need to remake every time.

why would you want a yakslapper when you can make essentially the same weapon but a pvp version?

and i highly doubt someone would ahve all the runes and armour needed for every class they want to play. although that is easy enough for a monk or nuker i guess.

who honestly though is gonna have all the diff armours and runes? not a lot is the answer.

Navaros · Nov 13, 2005, 06:55 AM // 06:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

faction has and is serving the pvp role it was intended for.

Yes, this is true.

But my point is that since the Faction idea is not as good as it could & should be, "the role it was intended for" needs to become modified so that Faction has more uses.

Especially since Faction is the only point for GVGing or doing Comp/Team Arenas; so if you have everything unlocked and/or have nothing you want to unlock, playing in those areas is pointless.

Draygo Korvan · Nov 13, 2005, 07:26 AM // 07:26

When Anet lets me use skill points I earn on PvP characters then you can use faction to get stuff for PvE characters.

myword · Nov 13, 2005, 12:33 PM // 12:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by FireFox

Actualy, pve characters are better for these reasons, weapons from pve can be more specialised (Yakslapper). and if you do have all the armors / runes theres no need to remake every time.

uh... what? if you are only playing that one role with your PvP character then don't delete it and you won't have to remake it?

and i'd like to be able to do more with faction! buy non-tradeable dyes for my own PvP character maybe! i already have UAS'd so my faction gained is just going to waste

to whoever who said otherwise, PvP weapons that come with a PvP character are automatically customized for them